PowerCADD Future

PowerCADD & WildTools
Post Reply
poolvibe
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed May 29, 2019 9:33 pm

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by poolvibe » Tue Jun 29, 2021 4:57 pm

lava wrote:
Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:58 am
Jon Buswell wrote:
Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:10 am
It might well be that the idea of a users co-operative who collectively own this software and pay to keep it going - not for commercial but for reasons of continuity could be an option if the right people are found.
Can we as a group, with Todds blessing, conduct a feasibility study into the cost of a co-op of users contracting a third party programming company/consultant to move the core of the current version of PowerCadd forward to the current MacOS programming environment. Todd would be free to write his own ticket - either writing tool extensions in the mode of WildTools, or providing oversight - as he wishes, but relieving him of the pressure and deadlines, and economic risk of developing the next version.

Does that sound interesting to you? Todd? No risk or commitment needed at this point. Simply be available to answer questions of scale and scope that would permit a third party to make a projection. (I am sure we could not get a committed proposal without examine the code, but at this stage we just need a budget to examine the numbers and knowing what all would need to invest to move forward.)

Not agreeable to this path - can we facilitate opening a conversation with Trimble?

Greg, Maybe one of us should put up some sort of website to get a headcount of those interested? I am game to help out...

-Frank

SteveMouzon
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2019 6:39 pm

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by SteveMouzon » Tue Jun 29, 2021 5:24 pm

Seconded, Frank.

Steve

poolvibe
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed May 29, 2019 9:33 pm

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by poolvibe » Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:57 pm

I just picked up the domain savepowercadd.com. what's next?

SteveMouzon
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2019 6:39 pm

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by SteveMouzon » Tue Jun 29, 2021 10:14 pm

I can build a static site, but don't have the tools to build what should be a discussion group of sorts. But I'm confident someone here does.

poolvibe
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed May 29, 2019 9:33 pm

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by poolvibe » Wed Jun 30, 2021 11:45 am

SteveMouzon wrote:
Tue Jun 29, 2021 10:14 pm
I can build a static site, but don't have the tools to build what should be a discussion group of sorts. But I'm confident someone here does.
I don't think we want to fragment things with another Forum. I was thinking we could do a simple poll or interest list to get a headcount on how many of us really need to save this thing...

bellarchitect
Posts: 34
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2019 8:18 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by bellarchitect » Wed Jun 30, 2021 12:03 pm

Frank, Please give me a call when you have a minute. I sent my mobile number via private message. Thanks - Frank Bell

User avatar
lava
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2020 6:13 pm
Location: Merchantville, NJ
Contact:

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by lava » Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:13 pm

Yes - Lets just start a new topic here:

"Organizing to Move PowerCadd Forward"

The first step is consensus on securing value for Todd in return for supporting a move forward. It could take many forms - we must identify something that Todd can be comfortable with.

If one of our Admin's could create the new forum at the top level (I sent Derek a PM).

Then lets start a topic and pin to the top: "Head Count - post once only"

EDIT: This has been created - visit it here: https://www.engsw.com/PowerCADDForum/vi ... ?f=6&t=242
Last edited by lava on Tue Jul 06, 2021 8:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Greg La Vardera
www.lamidesign.com

Rik Negus
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed May 29, 2019 9:11 pm

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by Rik Negus » Thu Jul 01, 2021 4:57 pm

Has anyone being in communication with Todd?
As it stands if he does not let the program go it has no future and no value. I will only have value if time is invested in it to bring the code up to date with current standards.
Is Todd willing to make the list of current licence holder available so that they maybe polled on their view points, how many are willing to invest in a new version?
What would be the cost and time involved to update the program? I don't know a thing about programming, Alfred what is your perspective? Yes I know only one woman can give birth to a baby but .........
To allow this program to die would be a crime, I have 31 years invested in it, there are no substitutes of equal quality.

Todd, lead, follow or get out of the way, we the users want to move forward and are ready to put our money up to prove it.

For me, as I have said before, having Trimble take it over would be the most ideal situation in that they have the resources to carry PowerCadd forward.

For now as long as I don't update my OS it works, but this can not go on forever.

User avatar
todd@engsw.com
Site Admin
Posts: 41
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:42 pm
Location: Greensboro, NC
Contact:

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by todd@engsw.com » Thu Jul 01, 2021 6:35 pm

Rik Negus wrote:
Thu Jul 01, 2021 4:57 pm
Has anyone being in communication with Todd?
As it stands if he does not let the program go it has no future and no value. I will only have value if time is invested in it to bring the code up to date with current standards.
Is Todd willing to make the list of current licence holder available so that they maybe polled on their view points, how many are willing to invest in a new version?
What would be the cost and time involved to update the program? I don't know a thing about programming, Alfred what is your perspective? Yes I know only one woman can give birth to a baby but .........
To allow this program to die would be a crime, I have 31 years invested in it, there are no substitutes of equal quality.

Todd, lead, follow or get out of the way, we the users want to move forward and are ready to put our money up to prove it.

For me, as I have said before, having Trimble take it over would be the most ideal situation in that they have the resources to carry PowerCadd forward.

For now as long as I don't update my OS it works, but this can not go on forever.
Rik,

I'm sure you would have an interesting array of thoughts and emotions were I, without any training or knowledge, and without a view from the inside, to suggest how to save a design you created. There has been a lot of Monday morning quarterbacking regarding PowerCADD. I would like to remind everyone that I have been on the field for quite a while and have significantly more information than is available from the outside.

It would probably surprise most forum members just how many PowerCADD users balk at the nominal fee Engineered Software has always charged for updates. It would probably also surprise many members how many copies of PowerCADD 8 are still in use in the world by users who chose not to update. Users in this forum may be willing to invest, but that is not a general feeling among the PowerCADD population.

You are entitled to your opinion regarding "lead follow or get out of the way," which you have expressed several times. As far as what will happen with PowerCADD codebase, that has not been decided. Even though there is dwindling value in the UI portion of PowerCADD, the PowerCADD engine, which includes snapping, drawing, file IO, database management, etc, still has value. The engine has been modernized, performance tuned, built for 64-bit and M1, and functionally extended.

Part of the decision to end PowerCADD relates to the structural norms that a modern piece of software must adhere to. A major issue, and this has a significant bearing on WildTools, is that the freedoms to manage events and resources outside the control primary application is gone. All of PowerCADD's XTNL's manage resources as if they are the only thing running - of course PowerCADD does a lot of heavy lifting. I believe it is Alfred's notion is that it will take little time to convert WildTools to a new architecture. Unfortunately, the reality is that even WildTools would have a significant rewrite in order to go to a modern architecture.

Alfred, I encourage you to chime in on this. If you do, I would recommend for you to build WildTools with Xcode 13 using the current SDK, first. Though that won't reveal what architectural changes are be in store. That will give a notion of what API is not there that both PowerCADD 9 and WildTools 10.6 depend upon.

I am not inclined to publish a list of the PowerCADD License holders. Without the licensee's permission, I can't publish it anyway.

Todd

Rik Negus
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed May 29, 2019 9:11 pm

Re: PowerCADD Future

Post by Rik Negus » Thu Jul 01, 2021 8:03 pm

Thank you Todd for your response and clarification.
No matter what our agreement maybe, I only want PowerCadd to have a future.

Post Reply